AI rework

[Corvus]

No real complaints here on the WDS AI. Like most people, I play a lot of scenarios against the AI. Yes, sometimes it seems really "dumb," but I suspect if someone were to look at some of my moves, they would also appear really "dumb"! I've mostly not noticed anything that I would not also occasionally expect a human player to do, either through bad reading of my intentions, or simple misjudgements. Of course, any AI is doing neither, but is instead developing responses to a fixed, and relatively simple, rule set. Not surprisingly the AI seldom makes the sort of "boot" TTP/game execution errors that I occasionally do, e.g., driving into a marked minefield, not keeping enough points to deploy, miscalculating movement costs, etc... It's a computer, after all, and is pretty good with the rules. What it may lack in operational elan, it frequently makes up with seriously complete bookkeeping.

I do have a question however. On more than one occasion, I've played a scenario (Modern Campaigns mostly) against the AI and, on occasions, particularly when I'm doing well it seems, the AI appears to ... well, "quit." It's like it just gives up. I'll play 10 turns of a 25-turn scenario without the AI doing much of anything. When the scenario ends, and enemy positions are revealed, there seems to be no rhyme nor reason nor logic to the AIs actions or dispositions. He frequently will spend the last few turns maneuvering aimlessly or indecisively, or simply banging away at some isolated unit I have left dug in on some valueless piece of terrain. I can play the same scenario, same side, and if I move just a bit differently, it seems like the AI stays in there and fights back well, just like he usually would. Anyone else notice this? Is it what people are calling "bad" AI? Is it because something in my dispositions or movements is outside the boundaries of the AIs rule space? Is this something I might be able to address through the AI script editor mentioned above?

[Sunbather]

I was already ready to pull the trigger when I stumbled upon the many, many complaints about the AI. And reflecting what I've been experiencing in the demos so far, I must admit to myself that the AI will drive me very angry eventually.

I really think serious work needs to be done here. There is no excuse anymore to have no good AI in a wargames, be they 2D or 3D. As I understand, this whole WDS thing is here to carry the TIller games into the future. And AI is definitively a part of the future.

[zovs]

I would not let the AI drive me away from WDS games. Learning verses the AI is fine and more importantly there hundreds of folks eager to PBEM with you and that is where the games really shine with two humans.

[Sunbather]

I would not let the AI drive me away from WDS games. Learning verses the AI is fine and more importantly there hundreds of folks eager to PBEM with you and that is where the games really shine with two humans.

Similar to Gamerdoc, I might play a game for 2 weeks straight but then go on a month long hiatus. At other times, I just want to have a "quick", 2 hour long battle to satisfy my desire for a specific region or conflict. So I am not really inclined to have prolonged email matches over the course of some weeks, and I also want to start playing when I start playing.

Also, this whole PBEM thing never really turned me on. When I sit down to play a game, I want to stick with it until the game is over.

But I want to end with a productive question: is there any way to play a whole small or medium sized scenarios in one sitting. Like hotseat but online? I know the Combat Mission titles have such a thing. So both parties would need ~3 evening hours to play and finish a game.
After all, I would be more than willing to finally dive into multiplayer when it comes to strategy wargames.

[RickyB]

I would not let the AI drive me away from WDS games. Learning verses the AI is fine and more importantly there hundreds of folks eager to PBEM with you and that is where the games really shine with two humans.

Similar to Gamerdoc, I might play a game for 2 weeks straight but then go on a month long hiatus. At other times, I just want to have a "quick", 2 hour long battle to satisfy my desire for a specific region or conflict. So I am not really inclined to have prolonged email matches over the course of some weeks, and I also want to start playing when I start playing.

Also, this whole PBEM thing never really turned me on. When I sit down to play a game, I want to stick with it until the game is over.

But I want to end with a productive question: is there any way to play a whole small or medium sized scenarios in one sitting. Like hotseat but online? I know the Combat Mission titles have such a thing. So both parties would need ~3 evening hours to play and finish a game.
After all, I would be more than willing to finally dive into multiplayer when it comes to strategy wargames.

Yes, online play is doable. It has been years since I played that way outside of TillerCons in person on a network versus the Internet. You could grab a demo and see if someone will give it a try with you. And there are scenarios in most PzC, MC and PzB games that are playable in a few hours if you have someone else available at the same time.

They even allow team play that way with forces divided up so all players on a side can play at the same time, speeding up larger scenarios.

[All_American]

But I want to end with a productive question: is there any way to play a whole small or medium sized scenarios in one sitting. Like hotseat but online? I know the Combat Mission titles have such a thing. So both parties would need ~3 evening hours to play and finish a game.
After all, I would be more than willing to finally dive into multiplayer when it comes to strategy wargames.

FWIW, that's usually how I play my PBEM games. I sit down with friends one afternoon and have a medium sized scenario get going. Takes longer than an afternoon to complete, usually, but doesn't take weeks. Perfectly willing to do the same with you as well!

[nelmsm]

Never done it but being retired now I have some time and would be willing to give it a try.

[Sunbather]

FWIW, that's usually how I play my PBEM games. I sit down with friends one afternoon and have a medium sized scenario get going. Takes longer than an afternoon to complete, usually, but doesn't take weeks.

That's good to know! And yeah, obviously you pause the game when it drags out too long and leave it for another day. Anything fine by me as long as I can play more than 1 turn.
Do you give yourself houserules then? I.e. 5 minutes for 1 turn?

Perfectly willing to do the same with you as well!

I might very well come back to you once I have decided on 5 games to buy and established some deeper knowledge of the game. However, as it looks now, I am only interested in the Modern Campaigns! Although I might buy a Panzer Battle or Panzer Campaign game but I just couldn't decide which one.

[Sunbather]

Never done it but being retired now I have some time and would be willing to give it a try.

I might report back once I've bought the games and had some training!

[sdporres]

FWIW, the whole PBEM thing never appealed to me either and I resisted these games for years. Last fall I was tinkering with the free demos but still didn't really "get it".

Then I bit the bullet, bought my first game, and found someone to play PBEM.

I own a bunch of the games now =D